Last week I caught up with Damien McKenna from Orwells ’84 to talk about the band’s new single ‘She Is So Sweet’, the craft of songwriting, the band’s upcoming album as well as his friendship with David Keenan.

Orwells ’84 have returned, bringing their familiar sound to the masses with the release of their latest single “She Is So Sweet”. The track is the third release from the band’s well received debut EP “Truth is the First Victim”, which garnered attention in all the right places. The band recorded most of ‘Truth is the First Victim’ in Sun Studios in Dublin with Pauric McCrum and Peter McCoy of Pillowhead. This is the band’s second venture with the duo; having worked together previously on the single “Cailín”. Brimming with traditional tones and cheery refinement, ‘She Is So Sweet’ is perhaps the perfect single to release at the moment. 

“I think we always viewed that particular track as a strong track musically, there’s a lot going on in it. It’s definitely the most lighthearted track on the EP. It was always going to be something that we would release and we decided that we would make it our third single because, you hear stories your third release should probably be your strongest release. So we held off and that was the reason why we used it. We just think it’s a good radio track and it’s a very pleasing track for people to listen to“

Radiating indie elements, folk tones and wonderful melodic progressions, ‘She Is So Sweet’ has a hearty sound that is wholesome and rich. I wondered how this lush backdrop and instrumental vibrancy came together.

“We started off with the melody first…then we were working originally with a violinist called Pierluigi Cioci and our cello player at the minute Ella, and they created the string pieces which kind of sat in sync with the melody of the vocals which really brightened up the whole track. We wanted to go with that because it sounded a bit Beatles- esque, we wanted to go down the psychedelic route as well.The whole concept of the song is that it’s a love story gone wrong. It’s a guy who is in love with a girl, she’s not interested but then when he’s gone she then becomes interested. But it’s just toying around and playing with it and the bouzouki plays a big part in it as well. We tried to make our bouzouki sound something like Johnny Marr from The Smiths would play. I don’t know if that makes sense but that’s kind of what we were going for, to make your bouzouki sound like a guitar and make your guitar sound like a piano.So, yeah, that’s where we got it from.”

‘Truth is the first Victim’ is an interesting title for an EP. A title like that had to have a tale behind it. I wondered what was the story behind the name.

“When we were putting together the EP. At the time Brexit had just been passed, so there was a lot of talk about borders, and being from Dundalk we were in the midst of looking at what would a hard border look like again between North and South. Obviously, in America you had Trump and all this kind of talk was going on. So we started the EP, a year ago and still to this day it’s really strong this division between people. You hear about the extreme left, far right, and this kind of division is set and it’s embedded in our community, it’s embedded in the world at the minute. So it was a real of sense of this division, and I was in the Museum for Modern Art, just looking around one day. It was an exhibition by a photographer called Les Levine, who was doing photographs on Derry in 1970 around the division for young people, and around how it was impacting them, some really powerful photographs. One of the photographs was called, Truth is a Victim. So I thought that was a fantastic idea and you always hear there’s one side of the story and there’s another side of the story and somewhere in between, lies the truth and we just felt, in this day and age, because of social media, because of everything else and because of to coin a term that’s very much in use.. the fake news that’s out there, we genuinely believe that, when these things happen or when there’s stuff going on the truth is the first victim. It’s never the thing that people go to because there’s not a good story. You know, they all say don’t let the truth get in the way of a good story. So that’s where it came from.TV shows are an embellishment of the truth. We want to live our lives as these things, you know, filters, selfies. All these things are led to show or to allow people to live a different life, and as you say, the truth of their life may not be as good as what they’re able to present…I think people fear the truth. Some people don’t want to hear the truth, and as you say sometimes the truth just isn’t a good story. It’s a shame it’s a really dark way of looking at it but, it’s a powerful message that we tried to get out and, in fairness, you were the first person really that picked up on that, like what were we trying to say with the EP, because we’re not a band that would put something out and then just call it something flippant, that’s not art. Everything you do, everything you say and everything you put out to the public, as an artist should have some sort of message behind it and whether that message is to make people think, what are they trying to say, or whatever, it’s something to say, something along the lines of getting someone to think about their realities then it’s all beneficial and it’s all art. So, that’s why we were going through that title, and when I suggested it to the guys they loved it”

What is striking about Orwell ‘84’s tunes is the tight instrumental arrangements and songwriting. How they craft their songs can vary from song to song

“We’ve tried many different types, different forms of writing but generally what works for us now I’ll write an idea or a verse or chorus and we’ll play it out. Then we start putting the creative touches on it as we go along. Once we have the structure we tend to put the microscope to it, and we will say ‘why is the strings playing this bit why can’t the strings maybe try something else’ or ‘how about we take the drums out of this bit’ or ‘how do we use the bouzouki instead of the guitar again just to use it. When we did ‘Cailín’ someone suggested, have you listened to Lankum. When it comes to trad music they use this harmonium which isn’t a trad instrument, but they use it so very well that we decided, well, why don’t we try and get a harmonium and create that drone on ‘Cailín’. So the idea comes or the general idea or the lyrics will come from myself and the melody, or the foundation for the melody, and then it’s about the creative piece and getting together and really trying to focus in on what’s going to work, and what’s going to benefit the track”

The Ballad of Frank Owens is the final track on the EP. The band play strings as if they are guitars in the song and it seems the actual guitar takes a backseat.

“On our vinyl, actually, it’s the first song and that was because we created an orchestral piece to open the EP on vinyl, which was more of a selling point. We decided that if people want to invest in the music or invest in the EP that they’ll get this bonus track, so we restructured to make it sound like that and then we used samples of famous speeches about the border and about division and one of them was Martin Luther King saying that, ‘I have seen the promised land and I may get there with you someday’ and then there’s a line of Frank Owens about the promised land so we just said that flows better. When it came to the EP digitally it’s just the orchestral build up at the end it’s the strings, it’s the cello playing the fast vibrant part. it just kind of ends, a bit better, and I suppose, in a way, it kind of bookmarks instead of ending this chapter in our music, where it leads us to think, because Frank Owens is a very socialist song, and it leads us to think ‘well, is there hope out there, can we get together, is society doomed or are we going to be able to drag ourselves up by our bootstraps and move forward?’ Frank Owens for me , it’s probably my favorite track on the EP.”

Listening to Orwells ‘84’s music and the progression of their songs, I am intrigued as to how the band blend their instruments together. Each instrument can be clearly heard and yet at times the tempo picks up and the instruments seem to merge into one flowing musical arrangement. It reminds me of a stream of consciousness in writing. I wondered if the band strives to create this aspect of their music or does it just happen naturally.

“It’s both. I’m blessed with such a large band.I’m playing with five fantastic musicians who can throw their hand at anything or can create anything.So we might play the track once and then we’d sit down and then we’ll say, ‘I heard you play something like this, what were you playing’ and then we’ll focus in on that piece, or sometimes it generally can be when we just play the track it just happens organically. But we do, in our recording and in producing music, we do tend to look a lot at the structure, and I’m a big fan of The Beatles, big fan of, you know, that pop structure. I know, people will argue The Beatles aren’t pop but that kind of, four bars, chorus, bridge, I’m a big fan of that and I think that’s the foundation of music you know. I think, if you look beyond that, then you’re getting creative, or you’ll get, I’ll say avant-garde but you’re becoming a bit more out there with what you’re thinking or your thought process.”

“Generally it’s just a mix of both, you know, we just really are blessed that Peter (McCoy) and Pauric (McCrum) who produced it are very good at honing in on them things as well, and saying ‘look the dynamics are not working here, maybe we need to change this, what about the tempo of this?’. A good example on the EP would be ‘You Took The Night’ it started out as a country, Neil Young kind of song and then we played it as it is now. Then everything started being added on top of it, and it was through playing it together in a faster tempo that the piano was introduced, doing the stabbing chords and the strings were introduced doing nearly a counterpoint to the piano. So, really it can be a stream of consciousness sometimes but I would mainly say it would lean on the side of definitely a thought process more so than a stream of consciousness.“

Even though Orwells ‘84 are a band of multi instrumentalists with different creative ideas there are no arguments or issues with creative differences, the band are very much a family.

“Not really no. I mean, I always joke, Peter (McCoy) and Pauric (McCrum) because on the fact I’m a fan of The Beatles, I could sit in the studio for a week, focusing on a chorus. If I was allowed. I always have these grand ideas, especially around stuff like titles of EP’s and all that. I always have these elaborate ideas and Peter and Pauric are very good and I don’t know how they do it, they have this way of coming back to me and saying ‘that might work, but what about this’, and nine times out of ten they are generally right. I don’t think we’ve ever had a disagreement… I think it might have happened once and it might have been on ‘Frank Owens’ when we were recording it. They suggested something with a melody and I had kind of said no, not doing that, That’s too, like heavy metal, and I’ve nothing against heavy metal music it’s just not my scene but even that was amicable, we didn’t come to blows over it. We’re a band, we’re very much a band of brothers and sisters, we’re in it together and I think everyone respects everyone’s opinion. We’ve got accomplished musicians, Róisín and Ella are both trained classically in violin and cello both played with Cross Border Orchestra so they are qualified musicians, Sean Byrne can play any instrument that he wants, he just has to pick out and figure out where the notes are, and then Peter and Pauric are very good at knowing what’s going to sound good. So, if you allow yourself to respect the opinions of these people, it just makes it a whole lot easier. I can come up with all the grand ideas I want they will either tell me that it’s not gonna work in their own way, or maybe refine and hone in on what would work for my idea so I’m happy enough. It’s a very happy medium that we’ve got, and I hope it never comes to a day where we have to start throwing down and having fights, because I love them.”

Orwells ‘84 have performed with the likes of David Keenan, Nix Moon, Myles McCormack from Belfast group Lonesome George and Finnian among many others. David Keenan has become a friend to Damien. I wondered what he has learned from performing with these artists.

“I suppose the biggest lessons that we can learn was from being around David and watching him and his professionalism backstage. David is one of my best friends so I’ve seen him grow from a songwriter when me and him were putting gigs on in Dundalk to this massive star now. It dawned on me just shortly after we had supported him, I was watching the show, it might have been the Olympia Show I think and he had like himself, then it was himself with The Organics then it was himself and The Unholy Ghosts and then he had supporting artists coming in to do stuff and then he had ballet dancers and stuff. He would often reference that kind of Rolling Thunder documentary of Bob Dylan with this traveling circus of musicians that this is what he wants you to do. We all know that was chaotic but when you find out then that, you know, Bob Dylan was in total control of that, he knew exactly what he was doing and it was the same with David. Watching the professionalism, how to get it together, what they were doing. I’m not saying we weren’t professional but these guys they were there from five o’clock that day, they weren’t leaving any stone unturned..and even just stuff like getting the guitars out they’d all kind of get together and sing, it was good vocal exercises. So it was that kind of eye opening experience to look and go, you know, this is what it takes. This is what you need to do. If you want to be, I suppose on top. We never did this but loads of bands just turn up five minutes before the gig plug in and turn up to 10 and start playing and that doesn’t really work, because you’re, losing yourself in your own chaos then.”

“During lockdown David would write something, and then he’d send it to me and say ‘what do you think of this’ I’d be like ‘ah its amazing’. Then I’d send him something and say ‘what do you think of that’. Just after lockdown we sat down with our notebooks out and I’d say ‘what do you think of this’ and I’d play it and he’d say, ‘don’t change to that chord’ because you know, there’s a thought process behind it and as we were saying at the start nothing’s done by chance and nothing’s left to chance everything’s thought out, he’d say ‘why are you gonna do that’. He’s younger than me but he’s, definitely someone that I would look to as a teacher for me, you know these kind of things, because it’s so natural to him. It helps as well that we have similar tastes in music certainly when it comes to that kind of stuff of, using the instruments you have around you, using the process of music and using the process of creativity.”

“You just don’t write the first sentence that comes into your head, and then go out and play it. You write the song, then you come back to it maybe a week later if you’re not happy with it and you see what’s going to change or what you need to change and that’s the way it has to be if you take your craft seriously, that’s the process that it has to be. There’s no point in being fed from the bench, if you’re going to say something make sure you’re saying it the way you want it said. My style has grown over the years and it’s still maturing really, and it will probably always change. I’ve tried many methods, I’ve tried the William Burroughs method of the scrap paper writing, I’ve tried cutting newspaper articles and putting stuff together,I tried many things. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t and if it works it’s wonderful. If it doesn’t work then it doesn’t work. A painter will sketch hundreds of sketches for one canvas and then they will go and they will deliberately put on the canvas what they’re looking for, so it’s the same with music.”

I wondered what advice would Damien have for an aspiring songwriter or musician.

“I suppose, you just have to keep writing. You often hear of Gaelic players, taking 20 footballs and trying to kick them all over the bar. They’re doing that because when it comes to Sunday or whenever they’re going to play they are going to be able to do that instinctively, its the same as song writing, same with your voice, your vocal your instrument. Whatever it is you need to sit down and play it, you need to be comfortable with it, you need to know what you can do what are your limitations, where you want to go beyond. Also, I suppose it’s just get comfortable with what you’re doing and then when you’re comfortable push yourself further and continue to write and never look at a situation that presents itself as nothing more than a situation, there’s always going to be something there that you can take for a song. Listen to music, because there is only so many chords out there. “

Orwells ‘84 have released a video for ‘She Is Sweet’ and are making plans to release an album.

“ At the minute we’re in the middle of pre-production for the album so that just seems to be a natural progression for us. We’re really looking forward to that. We’re also looking to do a creative piece with An Táin in Dundalk, we’re going to work with a performance artist and we’re going to do a live performance but it’s going to be pre-recorded. So it’s gonna be shot live with the performance artist, doing her thing on stage, she’s already in the middle of it. I’m looking forward to seeing how it all comes together.  She has some big ideas. We have some big ideas as well, different stuff we’re gonna try. We’re supposed to be back supporting David in the INEC. But I think that was pushed out again to December so I think we’re just gonna wait to see what the story is with live music.”

Fingers crossed Orwells ‘84 can film that live show and can get back to gigging again soon. They are a talented bunch of musicians who showcase their effortless, ambitious talent through enjoyable, rich and vibrant tunes which display lyrical depth and remarkable songwriting.

You can support the band through their bandcamp page here https://orwells84.bandcamp.com/

Watch the video for ‘She Is So Sweet’ below

Author : Danu